Whew insurance, WTF hospitals?

[thistlechaser]

I got my itemized bill from the hospital today. I have insurance (THANKFULLY), so it was sent for my information.

I was in the hospital exactly 14 days.

Total bill? $144,769

I nearly fell over. Just the hospital room and (awful) food cost $84,000 for the 14 days.

My antibiotic, the only one that worked, cost $250/dose when put in by the home nurse. When put in at the hospital? $3,990/dose.

I'd like to have a word with those who claim America has the greatest health care system in the world. The service I received was nearly 100% perfect, I have no complaints at all there, but the prices are just so unreasonable that 'unreasonable' doesn't even describe it.

One shot of nasal spray for a stuffy nose, put in by me, cost $179.

In related news, I'm still on the mend. Getting better every day, but still weak and little energy. Returning to work on Monday, so we'll see how that goes.

Comments

[kelen.livejournal.com]

What you need to do is get a lawyer. Why? Because the hospital will charge you for EVERYTHING THEY POSSIBLY can.

That $1 sharpie they've had for six months and used to mark your chart with? They will charge every patient $3 for. :P

Fight this. Get an itemized bill and start demanding things you KNOW are bullshit be removed. I've heard of people reducing their bill to 1/4th what it was.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Luckily insurance covers most of it, so no need to argue it. I'd love to just because the charges are so high, but I don't have the time or energy. You're right though!

[fbhjr.livejournal.com]

I'm certainly glad you had insurance!

The costs are ridiculous. No doubt about it.
The question is how to fix the system...

Re:

[resonant.livejournal.com]

....

Just for comparison, here's an anecdote from Canada:

A few years ago, I suffered head trauma. I stumbled to the nearby walk-in clinic, and was seen by a doctor who immediately called 911. I got to ride in an ambulance (but wasn't in any shape to enjoy it, sadly), got CAT scans, examination by specialists, and so on. Later, I went to my personal doctor to get the stitches removed.

At least four doctors examined me, plus various nurses, plus a three-person ambulance crew, plus I took up valuable diagnostic machine time. Plus bandages, needles and sutures, dressings, anesthetic shots, antibiotics, and a tetanus shot. I had been taken to a modern, well-equipped hospital, the same one that my Member of Parliament goes to.

Two weeks later, I got the bill. It was itemized:

ITEM 1: $40.00 - Ambulance ride, 9 kilometers
ITEM 2: $ 5.20 - Harmonized Sales Tax
TOTAL: $45.20

There was an apologetic letter saying they had to charge something to prevent people from using the ambulance as a taxi, but would gladly waive payment if it was a hardship. Just for comparison, the price of a taxi ride for that distance would have been $24 plus tip.

I am glad that the US seems to be moving (slowly) towards a better health care system. Until then, I am very glad that you had insurance.

Re:

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Wow... Amazing how different that is!

Re:

[resonant.livejournal.com]

And this level of care is provided to everyone*, for a total cost-per-person that is less than what the US spends for care for many (but not everyone).

Our system is FAR from perfect. There have been recent scandals about overpaying the company that provides helicopter air ambulances to my province, and the online medical records system had huge cost overruns. But it seems to work. And ever since I visited the US in November 2011, I've been grateful that we have it:

http://resonant.livejournal.com/329899.html


*there is currently a huge scandal how we are not providing proper health care coverage to refugees and others who are not Canadian citizens yet.

[resonant.livejournal.com]

*more details:

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2013/12/09/ontario_reinstates_basic_health_care_for_refugees.html

The Canadian government canceled free health care for refugee claimants, but the provinces are fighting back and paying for it out of their own funds anyway.

[ani-mama.livejournal.com]

I am seriously considering moving to Canada when I get older, just for the healthcare...my family has a history of cancer and that would bankrupt people here, even WITH insurance.

[resonant.livejournal.com]

Serious illness can still bankrupt people here - if you're too ill to work, your health care is covered, but you'll still burn through your savings with regular living expenses. Disability payments are not huge.

[ani-mama.livejournal.com]

Still better than here. We do not get much in the way of disability either, and at least the hospital bills won't be 10k a day.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

10K per day for the room (and food) alone. The highest care room I was in (for five days) was 10K/day. Then they moved me down a level and it was 9K/day, then lastly to an 8K/day room.

Every time I think about this, I boggle again.

[ani-mama.livejournal.com]

Sheesh, for that much you can have the Presidential suite at a world class resort and have personal valet service...

[resonant.livejournal.com]

We don't have pharmacare up here. Medication given to you in a hospital is free, but you have to pay for medication from a pharmacy. Medication prices are a lot less than in the US, but people living with chronic conditions requiring expensive medication will go through their savings quickly.

Re:

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Same! And I bet Obama has some ideas...

[elo-sf.livejournal.com]

Be very very glad you have insurance and be prepared to still end up fighting/arguing with them sadly. :(

This is why ACA/Obamacare is so important.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Agreed. Obama could go a long way towards fixing this, if the House let him.

[voidmagus.livejournal.com]

Unfortunately, you still will probably end up fighting. Unless you have amazing insurance, you probably will have to pay a deductible (usually a couple thousand, mine is $1500), after which insurance will pay 80% or 90% of the remaining bill up to a yearly out of pocket maximum (which varies pretty wildly - i know people with 50k max, 20k max, 15k max, etc).

The prices on your bill are also before the insurance company negotiates, so don't look at the percentages I named vs the 140k they're charging you.

As someone who spent a lot of his youth in hospitals and now is immune to most everything and a tolerance for pain that makes nurses squeamish -- our healthcare system has changed a lot in 20 years, and not for the better.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

I think I'm okay on that end (though not sure). I think I met my deductible before going in, though I do have a few co-pays (like $300/week for the mega-expensive antibiotic). Time will tell! Hopefully no big bills will arrive.

[voidmagus.livejournal.com]

I hope it turns out ok. Also glad to see you active on net again.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Thanks! Being back to work helps with that, haha.

[quistie.livejournal.com]

Welcome to America, where you can have premium health care at a super-premium price!

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Yep so true!

[kriatyrr.livejournal.com]

you can buy a house for less, if you're not too picky about where you live...

I'm glad you are recovering.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

I know! Crazy...

[ani-mama.livejournal.com]

Thanks goodness for insurance! It is crazy how much medical care costs in this country. It should be illegal to charge 4k a dose for medicine.

Glad to hear you are getting better, woohoo!

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Seriously! And thanks, I am.

[daturabelle.livejournal.com]

i'm certainly glad you got the care you needed but seriously?
those prices are downright scary. when i traveled to america, i was advised to take out the highest level of travel insurance i could possibly get just because i was going to america. never before have i had that advice to any other country i've traveled to. i don't understand how the costs can be justified.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

They really are scary. I wish we could do something about them.

[hamsterwoman]

Thank goodness for insurance! but, yeah, that's totally crazy.

Glad you're continuing to feel better! And hope work Monday goes OK.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Isn't it? And thanks!

[manue7a.livejournal.com]

current mood: okay
That's good!

That nasal spray must have been of gold.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

I'd get rich when I blew my nose, haha.

[spike7451.livejournal.com]

Good grief, I would have fallen over, I didn't realize health care was so expensive in America!!

So glad to hear you are getting better every day.

*hugs*

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

People can and do go bankrupt because of hospital stays. It's crazy.

[ashmedai.livejournal.com]

I'd like to have a word with those who claim America has the greatest health care system in the world.

That's absurd, America has one of the worst health care systems in the civilized world that I've ever heard of!

That bill is outrageous - I can't fathom how they'd ever justify such a cost.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Agreed! Some claim we have the best though...

[tea-blossom.livejournal.com]

That's crazy. Are you sure they didn't overcharge you?

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Nope. They broke it down item by item. Just crazy prices.

[doxxxicle.livejournal.com]

I knew it was bad, but holy cow! That's incredible.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Same. I knew it would be high, but that's crazy.

[loup_noir]

When I looked over the bills for the last six months or so of my mother's last illness, I was aghast. Her insurance was amazing, leaving me to pay for lots of lab works and doctor visits at $5 or $10 a pop, but the cost to the insurers was hideous.

As part of the vast American uninsured (yeah, we're running late), I honestly would apply my own tourniquet and drive myself to an open hospital (preferably our local clinic) before calling 911. If I had to have some joint replaced, I'd go to Mexico.

As for the US being the "best," pshaw! My cousin had treatments in the eighties that weren't being offered here. Sweden kept Lief alive decades past any of the estimates he'd have gotten here. Lief had a heart transplant, an extra kidney piggybacked onto his failing ones, tons of surgeries, etc.... Because Sweden gave a damn about the quality of life of its people, that's why.

Anyway, before I burst a blood vessel grumbling about the US' medical morass, it is so GOOD to see you post again. Take care and get well.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Same here, I have lots of copays (including $300/week for the mega-expensive antibiotics), but mostly insurance is covering everything. WHEW

Hope you're able to find a plan you like soon, and that it's dirt cheap! :)

[mel-redcap.livejournal.com]

Sweet mother of Murgatroyd, that is all kinds of fucked up. O_o;;

Hokay, another point of comparison: I am Australian. My husband and I have needed to go to hospital for a few things in the last couple of years. He has private health insurance. I do not.

Him:
- Kidney stone. ER visit (driven by me), lots of morphine, ultrasound, MRI, intravenous antibiotics, equivalent of an overnight stay, more antibiotics to take at home.
- Cut in the palm of his dominant hand. After-hours clinic visit (driven by me), local anaesthetic, buncha stitches, antibiotic.

Me:
- Miscarriage. ER visit (driven by him), overnight stay, ultrasound, more ultrasounds, follow-up visits every couple of days for a week, about three more visits a week apart each, loooooads more ultrasounds, assorted medication.
- Infected cyst-thingy. ER visit (referred by doctor and driven by him), what turned into effectively an overnight stay, minor surgery, intravenous antibiotics, more antibiotics to take at home.

Prices charged by the hospital? Cost to the Medicare system?

No freakin' idea. We did not get given a bill, or even an accounting of stuff we did not have to pay, because we did not have to pay one cent. There are things that Medicare doesn't pay for, or doesn't pay for fully, but ye gods I'm glad I live here.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Man! Wow, that's nice. Adopt me? :P

[tersa.livejournal.com]

I am terribly glad for insurance this week for less critical reasons.

*hug* Good luck back at work, and be sure to be kind to yourself. You sound like you're still recovering.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Thanks! I am, I'm taking it slow today and will head out a couple hours early. It's only 9:30 and I already feel ready for a nap (though that's not much different than any other day when I was healthy, to be honest. :P ).

I hope you don't have personal reason to be happy for insurance this week? You okay?

[tersa.livejournal.com]

Yes, but it's not remotely serious. :) I was just feeling very grateful for the ability to go in and have it checked out and not have to worry about how much it was going to cost to do so.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Oh ack! I did read that, just forgot. I was glad it's not that itchy, because a full-body itchy rash is a big pain!

Being able to get checked without worrying about the cost is SUCH a good thing -- there's enough to worry about just getting well!