Food and nightmares

[thistlechaser]

I had a nightmare last night, one that doesn't seem like it would be a nightmare, and less than two years ago wouldn't have been one -- it would have been a good dream.

I dreamed that my sister brought home four big grocery bags full of donut holes. All different flavors, glazed, some jelly filled. And because I'm me, I couldn't not have one -- not when they were all right in front of me, free for the taking. And because I'm me, I couldn't eat just one or two -- even knowing sugar would now make me sick, I couldn't stop eating them. I ate probably two dozen. Like in waking life, they weren't even that good, I just ate them because they were there and free and I wanted to make sure I got my share of them. Even knowing it would make me sick, I couldn't stop myself from eating them.

In the show West Wing, the character Leo is an alcoholic. In one episode, he described what it's like:

"I'm an alcoholic, I don't have one drink. I don't understand people who have one drink. I don't understand people who leave half a glass of wine on the table. I don't understand people who say they've had enough. How can you have enough of feeling like this? How can you not want to feel like this longer? My brain works differently."

I've never had something in a TV show resonate so strongly with me. That's exactly how I feel about food. Junk food tastes good, how can anyone stop with just one cookie? Just a bite of a slice of cake? One piece of fried chicken? How can anyone not sit down with a fork and just eat an entire cake? How can someone go to a buffet and stop with one or two plates of food?

Knowing that about my brain, I do my best to avoid situations like that instead of having to try to resist them. The nightmare really scared me though, the powerlessness I had over the situation.

All that being said, I don't know if I believe that food addiction is a real thing or not, but it doesn't matter. I don't need a name for this issue of mine, I just need to know it exists so I can avoid situations that I wouldn't be able to control.

Comments

[gonzostar.livejournal.com]

I completely and totally get this. I've had food nightmares of the exact sort and woke up all freaked out that I actually ate something I wasn't supposed to.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that was my first thought when I woke up -- had I actually ate them all? (I swear, I could still taste the sugar glaze in my mouth.)

On the plus side, I don't think I've ever less wanted to eat donut holes! :P

[elo-sf.livejournal.com]

Totally can relate to you on this, I don't understand the leaving food behind.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Agreed. Even now, even when I'm full and knowing eating more will actively hurt me, I still have a hard time not finishing it all.

[elo-sf.livejournal.com]

FWIW, many people with bariatric surgery end up overweight again because of this + the stomach stretching. Weight is REALLY challenging to manage.

I envy the fuck out of people who can just leave a plate of cookies sitting around.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Yep, that's what I meant about it "actively hurting" me if I do it. I try to cut it off at the pass, before I can overeat -- take a smaller amount, don't eat straight out of containers and such.

[eglantine-br.livejournal.com]

Yup. I can relate.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Sounds like a lot of us can, unfortunately.

[ani-mama.livejournal.com]

Food addiction is real. I think people can get addicted to pretty much anything, and food is probably one of the bigger ones.

I have problems with food also, but it comes from a slightly different place. I grew up poor. You ate what was in front of you, because that was it, there was nothing else. The idea of being picky, or not finishing your plate, was unthinkable.

Things are better now, but I still have this compulsion to finish everything on my plate. I am working on it, but it takes a long time to undue years of childhood conditioning...

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Things from childhood are so hard to get over, they're so deep inside you. I understand where you're coming from with that.

I have such a hard time not finishing my plate. I use smaller ones now, which helps somewhat, except when I'm eating outside of the house.

Good luck to us both!

[teaandfailure.livejournal.com]

Oh my god, what a terrible dream. D: I hate it when the brain takes your worst fears and weaknesses and throws them at you.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

And it almost makes it worse that not long ago, that would have been a good dream. Endless donut holes? As many as I could eat? WIN!

Stupid brain...

[ashmedai.livejournal.com]

I don't know if food addiction is real or not either, but given the chemicals, preservatives, denatured ingredients and sugar that's thrown into processed food, it wouldn't surprise me. And if it's an addiction, it must be one hell of a bitch to control, because as a former addict and alcoholic, I can quit substance abuse, but you have to keep eating to live! :(

I've had dreams like that about drugs and alc too, no matter how long I'm clean, these dreams of losing control always find me sooner or later. It's a relief to wake up and realize it really was only a dream.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Agreed to all that. I'm willing to believe one can be addicted to food, I'm just not certain of it... With all the sugar, salt, and fat they pump into it, it would be no surprise at all.

[ashmedai.livejournal.com]

Yeah, not to mention chemicals, pesticides and all sorts of crap. I'm fully convinced it messes with body chemistry in a way that can create a literal addiction to these substances. I also think they're aware of it, but making and keeping people addicted brings in the big bucks!

[ashmedai.livejournal.com]

I wonder, have you heard of this book: http://www.amazon.com/Diet-Cure-Rebalance-Chemistry-Swings--Naturally/dp/0143120859/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1462332547&sr=8-1&keywords=the+diet+cure+julia+ross#customerReviews

I only noticed it because it seems to be a similar concept I used to break addiction patterns to drugs and alcohol, with information and healing using natural supplements (particularly L-Glutamine, Tyrosine and L-Tryptophan in my case). If her ideas are even half as effective and scientifically sound, I'd definitely recommend it!

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

I hadn't, but it looks interesting. Thanks for the link!

[socksofjello.livejournal.com]

Anything that activates the reward centers in your brain can become a behavioral addiction in the right (wrong?) conditions. Dopamine is a hell of a drug!

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Yep. And while I was researching it this morning, I read that some people get more dopamine than others from eating, so there's that too.

[wow-hazmat.livejournal.com]

Food addiction is especially difficult because you can't quit eating. Food is kinda necessary to live, after all. :)

What *I* can't understand is people who can have "cheat" days on diets, where they have one day that they don't have any rules, then the next day immediately go back to their diet program. It's like wizardry, like magic, like unicorns dancing on eyelashes.

Recently the spouse and I went off our diet for a week (little over, actually), but we're back on it now and I'm super proud of us for the off-time being /just/ a week(ish) instead of a month or five. 'Cause that's what usually happens when we go off-book "just for a day".

More generally, anxiety dreams suck.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

That's one thing I can sort of do. I have a cheat meal once a week (Friday night dinner), though it's not "all rules off" because my rules keep me from getting sick. I could have fast food though (rare), or fried stuff, or more than I'd usually eat (but still no sweets). Luckily that doesn't ruin it the rest of the time for me.

Congratulations on being back on it! Everyone is different, it doesn't surprise me one little bit that something that works for one person doesn't work for another.

Good luck to both of us. :)

[adam-0oo.livejournal.com]

This was really well written

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it.

[gconnor.livejournal.com]

For a lot of people there is something mental/emotional going on, whether it is a habit, or a side effect of the food that is self-medicating something else, or even an addiction or obsessive condition. If you suspect that's going on for you, best to see a therapist for a while I think.

But, I will also say that I noticed a huge difference in my own life when changing the balance of macros, in favor of less carbs and more fats. I noticed after the insane cravings went away, I would still look at food and think "Wow that looks great" but I could more easily pass it up and just go on with my day without my brain going crazy and reminding me over and over that there's donuts in the break room and they are FREE. So I would say don't rule out some physiological/physical condition too. This could be in combination with mental/emotional conditions too. A physical craving can take an emotional/mental eating habit and turn it way up in volume so instead of a simple choice it becomes a high-wire act filled with extra anxiety.

I encourage anyone and everyone to track macros for a time and experiment with different macro levels. I think you have probably done this, but if not you might consider it. Hitting a totally different number for 3-4 weeks sometimes exposes an imbalance where we didn't know there was one. It's different for everyone but for me, my preferred macros are 65% fat/15% carb/20% protein, and sometimes I adjust for activity levels. It's difficult to approach and fix any kind of emotional/mental component if there's a physical component going on too.

Good luck! Great progress so far, and I hope you can find a maintenance plan that works long-term and gives you some level of sanity.

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Thanks for the info! I hope so as well. Still working on it!

[sanj.livejournal.com]

I've just been led here by isis, some time after you've written these posts, because I'm just starting the process of getting ready for gastric bypass and she thought it might be helpful to see....

This is really resonant with me -- I have such a problem watching other people throw out dessert or leave things on their plate, like "are you gonna eat that?" I've gotten better with it, but it does feel like a compulsion.

Thank you for putting this record here, it's exactly what I need to see right now!!

[thistle-chaser.livejournal.com]

Hello and welcome! I think we must have crossed paths years back, because I have a LJ note set on your username. "Random Glee fan"

I still have that same problem, but I try to handle it from a different direction: I try to avoid the situation to begin with. That's a lot easier than seeing all the good things and having to resist them.

Good luck with the whole process! Feel free to leave me a comment if you have any questions or wonder about anything! I'm not an expert, but I had my surgery just over two years ago, and I've kept my weight off so far.